| Written by Elizabeth O'Brien, LifeSite | ||
| Wednesday, 22 August 2007 | ||
The Christian organization Interfaith Rainbow Coalition (IRC) organized the event, bringing together members of different faiths, including the Uganda Joint Christian Council (UJCC), the Bahai Faith, Pentecostal churches and other non-government organizations. | ||
Thursday, January 27, 2011
The Baha'i Faith may have had Something to do with this Murder in Uganda!
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Daniel, this simply isn't the case. What really happened is this. In 2007 an interfaith association in Uganda consisting largely of Christian denominations began to take an active
ReplyDeleterole in opposition to homosexuality in Uganda. In a single incident, a Bahá’í representative
to the association was unwittingly drawn into this controversy; this involved providing an
explanation of the Bahá’í teachings on homosexuality. The National Spiritual Assembly of Uganda took immediate action, and the Bahá’í community subsequently has had no part in
such matters. The idea that because of this one individual's misguided actions we are somehow responsible for the murder of a homosexual which took place more than three years after this incident is really ludicrous. Three months ago the Universal House of Justice stated the following in regards to the civil rights of homosexuals:
"The purpose of the Faith of Bahá’u’lláh is the realization of the organic unity of the entire human race, and Bahá’ís are enjoined to eliminate from their lives all forms of prejudice and to manifest respect towards all. Therefore, to regard those with a homosexual orientation with prejudice or disdain would be against the spirit of the Faith. Furthermore, a Bahá’í is exhorted to be “an upholder and defender of the victim of oppression”, and it would be entirely appropriate for a believer to come to the defense of those whose fundamental rights are being denied or violated."
They go on, however, to discuss the relevant teachings which govern the conduct of Baha'is themselves which as you know prohibits homosexual behavior. However, it goes on to point out: "the Bahá’í community does not seek to impose its values on others, nor does it pass judgment on others on the basis of its own moral standards."
It goes on to stipulate:
"In working for social justice, Bahá’ís must inevitably distinguish between those dimensions of public issues that are in keeping with the Bahá’í Teachings, which they can actively support, and those that are not, which they would neither promote nor necessarily oppose. In connection with issues of concern to homosexuals, the former would be freedom from discrimination and the latter the opportunity for civil marriage."
My reading of this statement is that Baha'is should oppose any attempt to allow discrimination against homosexuals but stay publicly neutral on the issue of civil marriage. This stance in no way resembles Uganda that were supporting the death penalty for gays.
I hope you are doing well Daniel and I wish you the best.
Interesting, but it is known that there is far more to this story than what you share here.
ReplyDeleteThere is no real thing such as "neutrality" as long as any "faith" secretly spies on its members, doesn't' protect its GLBT members from homophobia in the community, treats GLBT people as second class citizens, when governing bodies meet with out giving GLBT members the opportunity to defend themselves, continues to hound out and sanction its GLBT members, allows GLBT members of prominent families to live by separate rules, believes and supports backward science, and denies rights and access to any individual because of who they live with and love.
It is common knowledge amongst GLBT people everywhere that we are not welcome in this religion.
Sorry, this religion is far from being neutral as far as GLBT issues as concerned.
Susan,
ReplyDeleteI would have liked to see an official Letter from the Universal House of Justice that the issue in Uganda was addressed, and cleared the Ugandan NSA , Kampala LSA , or any representation of Ugandan Baha'i Administration of having any official involvement in this group in 2007. Such a Letter should be circulated in the Baha'i World where a small community like mine faced a potential PR nightmare (a town who is 50% GLBT). I had to personaly write the World Centre about the Uganda situation, and they did infact clear any official involvement, but many out there still believe Baha'is were involved. The recent murder , beating, and stoning of GLBT Ugandans will bring up the notion that Baha'is were involved in this anti-Gay Interfaith group once more. This conversation brings up about how the NSA of Guyana lacks neutrality in this subject matter, maybe their National Community received a similar Letter that the US Baha'i Community received, then again , maybe not...
Dan, common knowledge amongst a group doesn't constitute reality. I have yet to see a case of someone "hounded out" because of being gay. The Baha'i Faith does have standards regarding the behavior of its members. I have seen Baha'is, all along the sexual spectrum, who engage in flagrant behavior that results in administrative sanctions. But any Baha'i who is sanctioned for such is still a Baha'i. If memory serves me correctly, you decided, while a Baha'i, to marry another man. The fact is that such an action violates Baha'i marriage requirements and results in removal of certain administrative rights within the Baha'i community.
ReplyDeleteRegarding "neutrality", The Baha'i Faith does not seek to impose upon the wider society the moral obligations incumbent on its members. Baha'is cannot in good conscience endorse gay marriage, but neither should they seek to impose the Baha'i view of marriage on the wider society.
The Baha'is I know would defend the rights of gay people not to be discriminated against in housing and employment, to be protected from persecution and hate crimes, and to be free to love. When a person is both Baha'i and gay, then the Baha'i code applies to that believer. It is a difficult road to negotiate, no doubt (and I have reason to know it to be so). The spiritual benefits of walking a path of service with Baha'u'llah beckoning us forward and 'Abdu'l-Baha at our side is worth the risk. I would rather be among the believers than painting the Faith of God and the entire community with a broad brush. That is to simply mirror what you say you detest.
Susan,
ReplyDeleteThe name of that interfaith group was "Interfaith Rainbow Coalition Against Homosexuality" so it is difficult to see how this one person overlooked the goals of the group as being part of the wave of anti-gay hostility that is happening in Uganda. The person must have presented themselves as a Bahai representative and must have part of this group, otherwise how else would the Bahais be mentioned to start with. See my blog [http://bahairants.com/bahai-faith-homosexuality-its-getting-better-1358.html] which goes into detail about the news and yes, I know, the Ugandan Bahais are no longer involved in this group, but who would know except for the Bahais who are aware of that letter from the Universal House of Justice.
Actions are what count in the world.
Anyway the damage is done. In the news all over the place Bahais have been associated with anti-gay Ugandan activities. The Bahais have to do something show that this is not case now. Silence isn't enough. And silence or looking the other way isn't justice when people are being killed. So I ask you, are Bahais part of the problem in Uganda when they do nothing to help stop individuals being murdered for promoting equality for gays. Are they being neutral, if they do nothing to try and show that the Bahai community is not anti-gay.
If the answer is, Bahais shouldn't be involved, my response is, what it the point of the Bahai community if it looks the other way when gays are being murdered and then screams and yells, and rightfully so, about human rights when Bahais are treated likewise in Iran.
We are not secretly spying on gay Baha'is. Yes, homosexual behavior is not allowed according to the Teachings of Baha'u'llah but generally speaking no one asks what goes on behind closed doors. In any case, there is a distinction as to what is expected of those who claim to be followers of Baha'u'llah and those who don't. It is simply wrong to associate us with what is going on in Uganda.
ReplyDeleteAnonymous,
ReplyDeleteIf you send me a private email to smaneck@gmail.com I'll be happy to send you the recent guidance from the House of Justice and the NSA on civil rights issues as they relate to homosexuals. The letter regarding the situation in Uganda was a separate letter addressed to Brent Poirier. Do you know him? I too, was concerned by the incident in Uganda and wrote a Counsellor asking the extent of Baha'i involvement. He called me and told me that the House of Justice has since issued guidance regarding Baha'i involvement in certain inter-faith activities.
The point you are missing, Susan, is that any time a religious administrative body and its mass of followers are TAUGHT that people who are homosexual are ill, you are automatically setting up a distinction, and there is a very blurred line between a distinction and a prejudice. Do you really think that Baha'is do not look down upon and pity the poor homosexual? Poor suffering diseased souls! With this institutional distinction, the door is open to discrimination. Whether or not the Baha'is of Uganda were officially involved, they are on the side of those who believe homosexuality is BAD, and therefore open the door to those who believe something must be done to eradicate this BAD situation.
ReplyDeleteSusan, please… absolutely every single Gay or Friend of GLBT Baha'is I know of are or were spied upon, myself included. If you write something on a blog, chat room, or talk openly it is reported, and you are shunned… people report individuals to Baha’is leaders and secret meetings are held, files are opened, kept and unavailable to those they describe without the opportunity to examine what it is in them. You know as well as anyone else does, that one cannot live openly or honestly with their gay spouse or children without sanction or backbiting in this religion, as one can in any number of other religious communities – who incidentally, have the very same teachings as the Baha’is do. They have just worked out a way to love everyone unconditionally and are far more inclusive. It just my unfortunate karma / luck that the discrimination and bigoted treatment meted out to me when I was a Baha'i was not done at my university, as I could have sued them and become a very, very rich man! The Baha'is consistently violate laws and individual human rights that protect GLBT people in the home and workplace in California. It is hypocritical, shameful and a disgrace! I cannot tell you how many ex-Baha'is are active in the progressive community in my city, most of them are straight... and many of them left because of the dysfunction, homophobia, bigotry and dishonest treatment in the community. It is a well known fact amongst progressives that this religious community is homophobic, is extremely out of step, tramples on the rights of individual GLBT Baha’is, and believes in pseudo-science in relation to homosexuality. They have become a laughing stock amongst the progressive, educated and informed people in my city. The local GLBT papers (two) both have at least 6 adds from religious groups that welcome GLBT people unconditionally, the SBMG (my sangha) has formed a committee to discuss diversity – how they can attract more minorities and remain open and loving to GLBT people. I was invited to sit on a Hate Crimes Committee on my local school district when we had two Synagogues damaged by neo-Nazis 15 years ago… this was BECAUSE I am known as a Baha’i, as a married gay man and a professor. Yet no-one in the Baha’i community could say a thing to me, because they were too busy shunning, backbiting and sanctioning. The Rabbi who led the committee called me one day and asked me, “Daniel I have 2 women who want to get married, what should I do?” I answered, “Rabbi B, tell me, what is better two Jewish lesbians or two non-Jewish lesbians?” He thanked me and hung up… two weeks later I read in the paper that he had performed the first Jewish Lesbian wedding in his synagogue… this was years before Prop 8. 10 years later the place that SBMG meets every Sunday is his very same synagogue… The Baha’is have demonstrated by their behavior, their homophobia, there shameful bigotry that they would prefer that I and others become Gay Ex-Baha’is…
ReplyDeleteSomeone here said: "The Baha'is I know would defend the rights of gay people not to be discriminated against in housing and employment, to be protected from persecution and hate crimes, and to be free to love"
ReplyDeleteWell the Bahais I KNOW, like my own Persian mother once compared the hanging of gay youth in Iran to gays wanting marriage in the US. It's all wrong according to her. So here my friend is the problem. Your precious Universal House of Justice has done absolutely NOTHING to remove homophobia in this individual- one of the most devout, fund giving, "spiritual" Bahais who's family goes back to the Dawn Breakers. Why is that? I ask you and I ask Susan, why? Why is it the UHJ pulls out loving words of compassion for LGBT people ONLY when it is faced with embarrasing actions by Bahais such as this in Uganada (which is only one of many)? In my entire Bahai life, having lived in a number of communities with Persians, Europeans and Americans- I have NEVER once encountered a single Bahai meeting to dispel homophobia in the Bahai community. Racism? Check! Sexism? Check! Relgious discrimination? Check! (especially when talking about the plight of Persian believers in Iran). But homophobia? Uh, nope nothing Susan. Not a single damn thing. But plenty of incidents such as ex-gays like Lynn Schreiber given the opportunity at BNASAA conferences and Association of Bahai Studies groups to tout ex-gay reparative therapy crap. THAT kind of anti-gay talk you can find plenty in the Bahai community. But a simple, aggressive class, cluster group, Ruhi group whatever the hell you want to call it to make Bahais (especially Persian Bahais) end once and for all the homophobic attitudes? A class to make gay Bahai youth feel comfortable to come out and be themselves? Nope nothign, nada from the UHJ or NSA or even local Bahais such as yourself and other Bahais who are stunted into inaction when it comes to defending the rights of LGBT inside the Bahai community. People like you and the other poster who continue to try to sell to the world discrimination as equality, and conformity as unity.
-Peyam
http://www.shambhalasun.com/index.php?option=com_content&task=view&id=2289
ReplyDelete| Unless spirituality can pass through the gate
| of science, then of liberalism, it will never
| be a significant force in the modern world,
| but will remain merely as the organizing
| power for the prerational levels of
| development around the world.
Conservative bahais tend to be homophobic, some extremely so. Conservative iranian bahais think of westerners as being spiritually "dirty", and the wealthy are prejudiced against working and poor people. Gays and lesbians are generally socially marginalized in the bahai community. "Neutrality" is absurd, either a religion supports spiritually healthy forms of sexuality for all people, or the religion inherently promotes inequality.
Inequality promotes INAUTHENTIC forms of spirituality, and the LIES and DISHONESTY that arise from such cause a ripple effect in which dysfunctional personality types take over.
Instead of being characterized by TRUE healing, compassion and holism, a dysfunctional religious community becomes static and fundamentalist (narrow, conventional), and EXPLOITS most of its members.
Bahaism's current "teachings" and administrative policies toward homosexuality are backward and ignorant as are many of the religion's beliefs.
Bahaism is absolutist, and is an imperialistic religion that promotes prejudice against forms of culture and spirituality that are outside the judeo-christian-islamic context (particularly those that have no need for manifestations/prophets and that provide direct access to transcendence).
The following excerpt sums up the problem of all insularized, backward and dysfunctional religions such as bahaism in a postmodern world: if they fail to jettison their outmoded medieval metaphysics, they will inevitably tend to backslide into premodern modes of consciousness and social organization (imperialism, fundamentalism, etc.).
| Shambhala Sun | July 1999
| Liberalism and Religion - We Should Talk
| By: Ken Wilber
...
The way it is now, the modern world really is divided into two major and warring camps, science and liberalism on the one hand, and religion and conservatism on the other. And the key to getting these two camps together is first, to get religion past science, and then second, to get religion past liberalism, because both science and liberalism are deeply anti-spiritual. And it must occur in that order, because liberalism won’t even listen to spirituality unless it has first passed the scientific test.
...
---end---
Susan said "The idea that because of this one individual's misguided actions we are somehow responsible for the murder of a homosexual which took place more than three years after this incident is really ludicrous."
ReplyDeleteWhy is it rudiculous Susan? I think it is crazy that Bahais such as yourself stick your head in the sand. I'm sure the Christian fundamentalists who support their homophobic churches in uganada also do not believe that they are responsible- as you do. You are responsible. You are also responsible for the death of gay youth in the Bahai community who have committed suicide because they could not as you expect them to "overcome" their sexuality. And yes such deaths have happened; one such death spurred the creation of BNASAA, which of course is now a platform for reparative therapy. So stick your head in the sand all you want, but yes you are responsible for creating such a toxic environment.
A riveting thread here, I must say. The past few months, I've been encouraged by the increasing and deepening dialogue. Still, I hope we'll try to avoid personal attacks, because this is obviously an important discussion whose time has come, and there are very passionate voices, and very hurt voices at the table. I'm sure we can work to build bridges. I, myself, likely won't return to a religious life, but having been raised Baha'i, I will always keep my ear to the ground on this topic--because I believe in human spiritual progress.
ReplyDeleteAnd Daniel, your story is hard to hear, for any Baha'i, but you're absolutely right in your telling what you've observed and experienced. You're outspoken I gather, and that's sometimes fuel for the fire of those that want to silence someone (or simple don't know how to deal effectively and compassionately with something that scares them). You're an important voice though--and Sonja VanK is another I know of-- Walk carefully, but speak your truths and tell us what you see! :-)
ReplyDeletePT 1.
ReplyDeleteThank you Rogr, Susan, Sonya, Dan etal…
What the AO, and by association the majority of Baha'is are missing is a sense of compassion and reason.
When you sanction / remove rights of an individual for being GLBT, it is the same as throwing a person out. For example, my husband is Catholic, along with his very sweet mother (who goes to mass everyday) he disagrees with the Pope and much of what the church teaches, but they haven’t thrown him out for this or for getting married, in fact a friend of ours who is a priest (see the video on the links on this blog) who is a priest was more than glad to bless our marriage ceremony – obviously he couldn’t do the marriage ceremony, but he also didn’t care if we were married… in fact was delighted!
Most Baha’is operate as if being gay is shameful and wrong, should be cured, indeed they seem to find a certain delight in pointing out in the writings that it is a sickness to be cured, when in reality, the only place I have been made to feel shame is in the Baha’i Faith.
I spent the last 20 years inactive, alone, away from the Baha’i community, causing no harm to anyone. Yet always being true to what I had committed to be… even when it seemed lonely, sad, very hard at times…
Yet when I shared the news on the internet that I married my husband, I suddenly received a very inaccurate letter that I posted on this website removing me of my rights as a Baha’i. It was obvious that:
1. They were watching me all this time
2. That someone /some people were reporting my actions and those other GLBT freindlies
3. That they believe being gay and loving someone is wrong and a sickness
4. That GLBT people will always be considered second class citizens in this future new world order they are working towards
This shameful occurrence in Uganda, as well as the actions of the NSA of Guyana participating in a similar interfaith action of bigotry is bringing shame on the Baha’i Faith. But they still believe that we are the cause of the problem!
Pt 2
ReplyDeleteIn my own case, I was just tired of practicing alone, fasting, praying, going about all the rituals, alone… yet getting no support, or love… when I saw many of my GLBT colleagues and friends enjoying rich spiritual lives in a diversity of communities of faith that have the very same teachings as the Baha’is do.
I spent a summer as Fulbright Senior Specialist at Kathmandu University, and was housed very near Boudhanath Stupa, where I ended up going to almost every day (dawn and sunset). I just began to realize that I needed to move on, get away from this toxic, dysfunctional, lonely practice of hoping that “tomorrow in Haifa” things might change. Last summer a group of Buddhist nuns had a table at the Sacramento Pride festival – this was along side of about 20 different religious groups inviting people to worship/practice with them… the table incidentally was no more than 150m from where the Master spoke on the state capitol grounds when he visited Sacramento.
I decided to try them, that particular group was a bit strong (ritual-wise) for me… but it led me to the SBMG (http://www.sbmg.org/). The first time I went... very simple, promptly at 7pm every Sunday they hit a gong… there are brief announcements, the visiting teacher speaks briefly about mediation practice, he/she hits the gong… 40 minutes of silence… after which there is a break and then a dharma talk… it was to be honest the first feast I have been to that operated like a true feast… after it was over, I approached an older woman (they make a point of saying that out of respect, we will not approach you, you must ask us), and not wanting to be part of a homophobic community any longer, I shared my story of being thrown out of the Faith for getting married… she teared up, and looked deep into my eyes and said… you and your husband are most welcome here… I cried all the way home, and have missed but a few Sundays now.
The group meets in synagogue, and is growing every week by three to five people every meeting… I am included, I am loved, they are good people… there are dozens of gay people there. They are creating a community that is inclusive, and have a subcommittee that is meeting to discuss how they may increase diversity… including GLBT people.
I feel as if my time with the Baha’is damaged me spiritually, and that I am now in a healing mode… SBMG and the dharma is helping me with my anger, as is this blog - so forgive me if at times my mixture is a bit rich.
I created this space to share my experience, to show other GLBT Baha’is or in my case former Baha’is, that you have nothing to be ashamed of, indeed you have a great responsibility to share this pain, the homophobia, and bigotry we experience openly in order to give an accurate picture to the world of what the Baha’i Faith really teaches.
So it is that I have a Maitreya Buddha in my meditation space… and when I encounter one outside my home, I always bow just a little bit deeper to him… and remember being at the Shrine of Baha’u’llah that very last time, my head on the threshold, tears flowing, asking for help… and now I bow with deep gratitude for him showing me the dharma… and for him giving me this voice and permission to speak openly about injustice, bigotry and homophobia.
Namo Buddhaya, Namo Dharmaya, Namo Sanghaya!
Thank you Daniel for sharing your journey. I am proud to call you friend.
ReplyDeleteLast year, during the Fast, I dedicated my Fasting to bringing education and thoughtful questioning to my facebook family. This effort was to bring awareness regarding being truly inclusive as a Baha'i community; inclusive of LGBT friends and their families. I think, for the most part, my local Baha'i brothers and sisters tolerated me. No one really commented on my posts about LGBT and their plight or how other religions are being open to this group. No one commented about inviting LGBT into the conversation of Baha'u'llah's healing message and loving community. I think it is that no one wanted to step into the light of dissertation and discernment. It was so rewarding to have the Bahai Ridvan Message 2010 be about inclusiveness and making strangers into friends.
I know, that over the years [59 and counting], my life has been enriched by interacting, knowing and loving people who are LGBT and those questioning their orientation.
I know that other religious communities have found a way to minister to this group of individuals, whose hearts are open to spiritual growth and service toward mankind.
I know Baha'i have a chance for individual and community growth, joy, love and service, making strangers into friends, by being inclusive of this segment of our every expanding global family
Thank you SueB... you are a very dear, sweet and your compassion shines like a light... I pray that others will find what you and Sonja are doing for GLBT Baha'is as an example.
ReplyDeleteNamaskar!
Susan I assume that the letter you are referring to is the one dated 3rd of January. I see no reason why it should be secretly emailed or for an anonymous poster to reveal who they are to you.
ReplyDeleteIt is here:
http://senmcglinn.wordpress.com/email-archive/same-sex-marriages-6/
on Sen's blog for the world to read.
And it appears to be saying that on the issue of married gays, Bahais shouldn't take sides, meaning if a gay Bahai is married they should not be discriminated against.
W wrote: "I have yet to see a case of someone "hounded out" because of being gay".
My response to this is, well you must have been looking the other way when Daniel was hounded out, and many others, whose names I can't mention. Or you must have been not listening when Bahais, such as Susan, make statements like: "homosexual behavior is not allowed according to the Teachings of Baha'u'llah"
Bahais who seem unaware that such a statement is worse than saying to an African American "you must not practice as an African American." (according to that speaker's stereotype of what this means) Worse because they are claiming that Baha'u'llah is discriminating against gays. Bahais such as these don't supply anything from the Bahai Writings, instead as has been with me, they then launch into some complaint about my firmness of the covenant, when just one quotation penned by Baha'u'llah supporting their opinion that gays are to be discriminated against would do.
It is offensive to judge a person like an animal. As if being homosexual is about sex. As if one is not spiritual enough if one is gay. Bahais should realise that when they use the words 'practice' or 'behaviour' in this context it is offensive - creating a false 'other' which is a form of apartheid. Please consider the consequences of such thinking. Think to yourself, if you are a heterosexual, is it offensive to be judged as good or bad based on whether you are intimate with another person? That Bahais might feel sorry for you and claim to see you as equal, but they are judging you according to the idea that you must be alone or hide your otherness according to their idea of what otherness means. That you can only be a Bahai if you suppress this 'otherness,' and may still reject you even if, for example, you have a flatmate (as one of my gay friends was told by his NSA).
You might argue that Daniel wasn't married or that it didn't count as a Bahai marriage and therefore that he was hounded out by having his voting rights removed, wasn't really discrimination after all (let's see the examples of heterosexuals in similiar situations - losing their voting rights when they wish to affirm their union. Daniel was in a partnership before he rejoined the Bahai Faith in 2001.
See this letter below:
ReplyDelete“… the Faith accepts in certain cases unions which are immoral but accepted by the society in which the people live. In all these cases, because the union is accepted by the Faith, there is no question of a couple’s having a Baha’i wedding ceremony subsequently because, as the Guardian says, ‘Baha’i marriage is something you perform when you are going to be united for the first time, not long after the union takes place’. If, however, such a couple would like to have a meeting of their friends at which Baha’i prayers and readings are said on behalf of their marriage now that they are Baha’is, there is no objection to their doing so, although it must be understood that this does not constitute a Baha’i marriage ceremony." (to the National Spiritual Assembly of Peru, June 23, 1969)
However in 2008 the NSA of the USA saw this differently and stated that "It is with deep sadness that the National Spiritual Assembly has learned that you openly married your male companion in a same sex marriage ceremony…”
Does this imply that if he had been closed about his marriage it would have been OK? I hope not but W, you seem to imply that this is why is was OK for Daniel to be punished - because he was open. It seems from your post that you think it is ok for Bahais to pretend one thing in private and appear to be something else publically. I can imagine in a society where it would do damage to the name of the Bahai Faith gays might have needed to do this in some societies and many decades ago, but look around you, society in the U.S. has moved on from this prejudice. Gays no longer do damage by association, and are in fact valued members of society and I hope one day more Bahais will realise this. In fact it isn't too much to say that discrimination towards gays does harm towards the name of the Bahai Faith.
The same letter from the NSA also states that they are removing Daniel's voting rights because of his “support of homosexuality as an acceptable lifestyle for Baha’is”.
[the whole letter is here: http://revolked2.blogspot.com/2009/05/lets-start-with-consultign-about-my.html]
I don't see how this statement cannot be anything except discrimination. I support homosexuality as an acceptable lifestyle for Bahais with the same rights and responsibilities for all individuals, and I am a Bahai too. I am a heterosexual so I don't imagine I would lose my voting rights for having this viewpoint, but it seems that the NSA has used this as a reason for removing Daniel's voting rights. In my own country, the Netherlands, it is a crime to discriminate on the basis of sexual orientation.
my blog "Change is a Law of nature" [http://bahairants.com/change-is-a-law-of-nature-666.html] was a response to the news of hearing that Daniel's voting rights had been removed because he chose to be formally married in California when it became possible. It was actually a reaffirmation of his partnership and he celebrated this with Bahai prayers. (video complete with Baha'i vows in front of a judge: http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=57392452535880122&hl=en#
Thank you Sonja... I appreciate your insights and love!
ReplyDeleteDaniel only half my post made it. Here is the second part:
ReplyDeleteSee this letter below:
“… the Faith accepts in certain cases unions which are immoral but accepted by the society in which the people live. In all these cases, because the union is accepted by the Faith, there is no question of a couple’s having a Baha’i wedding ceremony subsequently because, as the Guardian says, ‘Baha’i marriage is something you perform when you are going to be united for the first time, not long after the union takes place’. If, however, such a couple would like to have a meeting of their friends at which Baha’i prayers and readings are said on behalf of their marriage now that they are Baha’is, there is no objection to their doing so, although it must be understood that this does not constitute a Baha’i marriage ceremony." (to the National Spiritual Assembly of Peru, June 23, 1969)
However in 2008 the NSA of the USA saw this differently and stated that "It is with deep sadness that the National Spiritual Assembly has learned that you openly married your male companion in a same sex marriage ceremony…”
Does this imply that if he had been closed about his marriage it would have been OK? I hope not but W, you seem to imply that this is why is was OK for Daniel to be punished - because he was open. It seems from your post that you think it is ok for Bahais to pretend one thing in private and appear to be something else publically. I can imagine in a society where it would do damage to the name of the Bahai Faith gays might have needed to do this in some societies and many decades ago, but look around you, society in the U.S. has moved on from this prejudice. Gays no longer do damage by association, and are in fact valued members of society and I hope one day more Bahais will realise this. In fact it isn't too much to say that discrimination towards gays does harm towards the name of the Bahai Faith.
The same letter from the NSA also states that they are removing Daniel's voting rights because of his “support of homosexuality as an acceptable lifestyle for Baha’is”.
[the whole letter is here: http://revolked2.blogspot.com/2009/05/lets-start-with-consultign-about-my.html]
I don't see how this statement cannot be anything except discrimination. I support homosexuality as an acceptable lifestyle for Bahais with the same rights and responsibilities for all individuals, and I am a Bahai too. I am a heterosexual so I don't imagine I would lose my voting rights for having this viewpoint, but it seems that the NSA has used this as a reason for removing Daniel's voting rights. In my own country, the Netherlands, it is a crime to discriminate on the basis of sexual orientation.
my blog "Change is a Law of nature" [http://bahairants.com/change-is-a-law-of-nature-666.html] was a response to the news of hearing that Daniel's voting rights had been removed because he chose to be formally married in California when it became possible. It was actually a reaffirmation of his partnership and he celebrated this with Bahai prayers. (video complete with Baha'i vows in front of a judge: http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=57392452535880122&hl=en#
thanks for part 2 Sonja!
ReplyDeleteOk... now I am confused... Will Rain Wilson loose his rights now?
ReplyDeletehttp://straighttalkonmarriage.blogspot.com/2009/10/voice-for-equality-rainn-wilson.html
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FSQQK2Vuf9Q
ReplyDeleteBeautiful! Compare his words with the UHJ saying:
"There is a wide range of sexual abnormalities. Some people nowadays maintain that homosexuality is not an abnormality and that homosexuals should be encouraged to establish sexual relations with one or more partners of the same sex. The Faith, on the contrary, makes it abundantly clear that homosexuality is an abnormality, is a great problem for the individual so afflicted, and that he or she should strive to overcome it. The social implications of such an attitude are very important. The primary purpose of sexual relations is, clearly, to perpetuate the species. The fact that personal pleasure is derived therefrom is one of the bounties of God. The sex act is merely one moment in a long process, from courtship through marriage, the procreation of children, their nursing and rearing, and involves the establishment of a mutually sustaining relationship between two souls which will endure beyond life on this earth."
(Letter of The Universal House of Justice, 5 June 1993, Homosexuality, p. 11)
How can anyone, including the UHJ, view this young man and his family as an abnormality?
W, Susan et. al. you should be ashamed of yourselves!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FSQQK2Vuf9Q&feature=player_embedded
ReplyDeleteWish I lived near the beach:
ReplyDeletehttp://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vc6lLi3s0Rc&feature=player_embedded#